My dear old friend, Gary Lamb, recently announced that he is going to start a new church in Canton. This has, of course, stirred up a great deal of debate. I’ve been silent about all of this up until now even though I’ve been getting a lot of questions from folks from all over the place asking me what I think. As much as it pains me, I feel that I must now say something publicly.
First, let me say that I think the twitter attacks against Gary are deplorable and they should be stopped. They are neither constructive nor godly. Second, I want to stress that I love Gary and under normal circumstances I would move heaven and earth for him. I’ve known him and believed in him for a very long time. Long before Ridge Stone/Revolution ever started and long before Gary became a bit of a rock star, I had the pleasure of being Gary’s friend and I hope to continue to be his friend for the rest of his life.
To be clear, the question at hand is really about when someone should get back into ministry after a serious moral failure. None of this is about forgiveness. Forgiveness should be offered instantly and I believe that all parties involved are at least trying to allow the forgiveness of God to flow through them to Gary. The real issue is about restoration, which is separate and distinctive from forgiveness.
I totally and completely believe in the restoration work of God. God certainly is a restoring god. Restoration is, however, an interesting thing. People say that the process is different for every individual and every situation and I agree with that to an extent. I don’t believe in a one-size-fits-all approach to restoration. Still, it must be said that there are some commonalities when it comes to true Biblical restoration. First, there must be confession. Second, there must be repentance. Third, restitution is sometimes required and, lastly, trust must be rebuilt before any area of authority is restored.
Now, it’s clear that once his sin was exposed Gary did confess. Although it is worth noting that he only confessed after the sin was exposed. Let’s be honest here. That’s a slightly different thing that just coming forward and confessing on your own. Still, Gary did confess via a written letter and I don’t think this point should be argued any further.
The next question is whether or not Gary has truly repented. Repentance is more than just simple confession. It’s more than just saying that what you did was wrong. Repentance is a turning away from the sin. It’s a fundamental change of heart. You’ve got to turn away from the things inside of your heart that led you into the sin in the first place. (Now, this is the hard part to write.) I’m going to be very honest here and say that I’ve never really felt that Gary truly had a change of heart. I don’t know that he’s repented. Even moments after all the allegations were confirmed and Gary was forced to confess, he was talking about pastoring again. It was as if his sin meant very little to him. The same pride that got him into his mess was manifesting itself like crazy just two days after the confession. Later, he refused to follow the path his hand-chosen advisers laid out for him. He refused to sign any agreement that would have required him to do anything. He knew that Revolution would take care of his family regardless so he just did what he wanted to do and nothing more.
By his repeated actions, it was clear to me that his goal was to leave his wife, hook up with the “other woman” and then jump back into ministry as soon as possible. Don’t get me wrong. I don’t think that Gary had some master plan to pull all this off or anything but certainly, once everything came to light, Gary had a strong sense of what he wanted to do with his “new life.” From the beginning, he wouldn’t even entertain the thought of trying to fix his marriage. He just felt it was beyond repair and, frankly, it seemed to me that he was far more interested in remaining with his new girl instead of doing the hard work of repairing his marriage with his wife. That, to me, is a massive problem and one I can’t just look past.
Those of you that know me know that Amy and I had some major problems in our marriage over a decade ago that just about ripped us apart. We hated each other and we were at the very brink of throwing it all away. God, however, had other plans and miraculously restored our marriage and, as a pastor, I’ve also seen God restore countless other marriages. I, therefore, am a big believer in trying to fix your marriage. Obviously, not every marriage is or can be restored but many are and I firmly believe every couple should at least try to fix their marriages before walking away. I think this is especially important when children are involved. Couples should always give God the opportunity, time and space to do His work in mending the broken relationship.
I’ll also add here that I’ve never seen a marriage restored (or even get moderately better) with an ongoing affair continuing. The truth is that you simply can’t work on your marriage and have an affair at the same time and expect anything positive to happen. Whenever Gary would say that it was no use trying to work on his marriage because “it died a long time ago” or whatever, it would seem like a very hollow statement to me because everyone knew he was still seeing the other woman.
The problem with all this, beyond the marriage being tossed aside, is that Gary is still flying by his rules and his rules alone. Gary says that he’s changed and I have no doubt that that’s true on some level. You can’t go through something like an affair and public scandal and not have a different perspective on life. Perhaps he’s gone through some stuff that will make him a better pastor in the long run, I don’t know. What I do know is that you can’t tell me you’re ready to get back into the ministry when your divorce isn’t final and you’re still seeing the other woman. You could try to explain it all day long but the end result is that you’re still making decisions based upon what you want and your own rules and not what’s obviously God’s will for you.
Gary says that he’s got friends that agree with him that it’s time for him to get back into the ministry and that he should do it in Canton. I truthfully can’t imagine any sane person with an ounce of common sense that would honestly give that advice. When I put it in the form of advice, it almost sounds comical…
Hey, listen, I know that you destroyed your marriage and almost destroyed a thriving church. I know that you broke every pledge you’d made up to that point. I know that you refused to listen to your advisers. I know that you are living with your new girl even though your divorce isn’t final. I know that it’s only been 8 months but I really think you ought to jump back into the ministry. It would also be great if you could do it in the same town.
Again, I seriously cannot imagine who on earth would think this is a good idea.
If Gary does indeed have new advisers in his life that are seriously suggesting that this is a good idea then I would have to question their sanity or motives. Regardless, something’s not right. I fear that Gary has surrounded himself with people that either don’t truly understand the situation or just want to ingratiate themselves in some way.
Now, the reality is that at the end of the day, Gary is accountable to his creator not to me. It doesn’t matter whether or not I think he’s repentant. Only God truly knows and some day Gary will give an account to Him about all this.
Unfortunately, as much as it pains me to say, I will not be supporting Gary in his questionable efforts to start a church in the same city where he almost destroyed one. I will not support his efforts to jump back into the ministry with a marriage in shambles and another woman on the side. I will not support my dear friend that I love because it’s just not right. It’s not the right time. It’s not the right move and it’s not the right motive.
Even if the divorce is finalized soon (and it may have been finalized yesterday for all I know) I still don’t believe Gary is in a place where he should be leading others. It’s just too early. You can’t break your pledges and oaths and promises to God, your wife, your family, your friends, your staff and your church and then turn around less than a year later and tell me your ready to lead again, especially when you’ve refused to participate in any type of real restoration program with any sort of oversight from a reputable group. Running away from your hand-picked board of advisers to find a group of folks that tells you what you want to hear is not a restoration process. It’s an I’ll-do-whatever-I-want process and it doesn’t speak well about your readiness to jump back into ministry.
Gary knows that I love him but disagree with his decision to start a church in Canton at this time. I say again, I love the man and I look forward to a day when God really does call him back into the ministry. When that happens, I’ll be first in line to offer my support. Until then, I pray that Gary would stop this insane plan. I also pray that our gracious heavenly Father will minister to Gary in a deep, refreshing, restoring way for an extended period of time to truly prepare him for the day that he is called to step back into a leadership role in a church.
You may wonder why I decided to blog about this now. Beyond the questions I’m getting, I’m just really concerned. I’m concerned about Gary. I’m concerned about Gary hurting himself and other people again. I’m concerned about the people that might follow him. I’m concerned about the body of Christ as a whole. I also feel that Gary is getting a lot of support from people that don’t know or understand the situation at all or, at the very least, don’t understand the difference between forgiveness and restoration.
I want to stress that I don’t want to hurt Gary or damage his reputation in any way. At the same time, I can promise you that this whole situation is a huge mess that should not be underestimated. The truth is that Gary does need your love and support right now but not your empowerment and encouragement to start a new church.
Dr. David Cooper was my pastor in Athens, Georgia for a few years. He’s a great leader and a great man. He’s also a no-nonsense kind of pastor. I told him at one point that I was feeling called to start a church and he gave me a bit of advice. He said, “Don’t start one unless you’re certain God’s leading you to do it because whether God’s in it or not people will follow you if you start leading and those people will get hurt if God’s not in it.” I never forgot that and I think it’s something Gary, and those that are thinking about following him, should consider.
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Tony, those are difficult words, but words that needed to be spoken. I do not know Gary and have never been to Revolution Church, but I do follow him on Twitter. When i stated that he was starting the process to plant another church I thought it was too early. Your words confirmed my thoughts on the subject.
You are a REAL friend for sharing in love what needs to be heard.
Amazingly well though out and well said Tony. I couldn’t agree more. My heart breaks for Gary and the whole situation. You are truly a friend to him.
Tony, Thank you so much for such a well reasoned and grace filled approach to a hot button topic. I have followed Gary for years from a distance and have never met him, but my pain at his sin and my concern over his recent actions have been very disturbing. One thing that shows me that Gary has some issues still to deal with is his Twitter messages. Just yesterday he posted that he took “Two Great looking girls door knocking to get business.” It appears that Gary is still focused on the very issues that caused the problem. I pray for Gary and have not commented or Twittered about him until this moment. I appreciate your tone of love, concern and biblical honesty in the face of great conflict.
Tony,
Great post… Very kind words.
I think it takes a lot of courage to be honest. Some people don’t take criticism (or the truth) well at all, but know that your heart is in the right place and I hope it is received by those that need to hear it. I live in Canton and have personally been a victim of Gary’s arrogance/messiah complex, long before all of this took place. Many of my friends have been hurt by him in various ways. I am very fearful for the people that still choose to follow him. Thank you for your post.
Tony,
I’ve never met you, nor have I met Gary. Having this play out in my own life, as I had an affair with a staff member 4 1/2 years ago, I know what it is like to be on Gary’s end of things. I loved your post, your honesty, your consideration of all involved.
There is a huge difference in being sorry for the consequences of your sin and sorry for your sin. Having never met Gary, I can’t comment on the condition of his heart. I know from personal experience that in order to restore my marriage, I had to die, my wife had to die, and God had to resurrect us.
Having spent 3 1/2 years out of ministry, God and one of my best friends, Pete Wilson have given me a second chance in ministry. It was a long and painful process…but to have the elders of the church I started, grew and almost destroyed with my affair, lay hands on me an my wife and commission us to move from Indianapolis to Nashville was a beautiful picture of redemption and of restoration.
Thank you for your humility and your honesty in this post. Part of our passion these days is getting to pastors and their wives and helping them before they melt down, before they throw in the towel, before their marriage and their church is completely destroyed.
Though I don’t know you or the situation I can tell this was extremely difficult for you to write. God bless you for standing up for what you felt was the truth path.
Thank you for this post, it needed to be said. This shows your love for the gospel, for God and for his church.
Tony, I just wanted to support you in what you said. I know that it had to be very difficult to share this, as someone who loves Gary so much. However, it needed to be said and I support and agree with your thoughts completely. I respond to this for two reasons. And absolutely not to attack Gary or throw stones at him. I reply only to 1) Affirm what you have said to support you. And 2) Because I hope, in the Lord, that Gary will read this and see, with the affirmation of so many brothers, that this is the truth. I pray that he will: repent fully, completely break off all ties with the other woman, stay in counseling, invest a year trying to reconcile his marriage, remove the idea of pastoring a church from his mind indefinitely, plug in to a local fellowship where he can just be loved on and restored spiritually, and feel the love and release these steps will bring with his Father in Heaven.
Tony, I just posted my thoughts a moment ago. In hindsight, I should have left “the advice” off at the end. If I feel I need to say those things, I need to say them to Gary. I just wanted to affirm you and serve as a witness to Gary to agree with what you said in hopes that he would receive it. Could you add my comments without the “advice” at the end? If not, I can resend it with that out. Thank you for saying these things. They needed to be said from a member of our movement with authority and respect of others. You have those things. Sincerely, Travis
Tony, thank you for writing this in a loving, truthful way. I’m sure it was hard for you but THANK YOU. I have been attending Revolution for about 3 years now. I hope that some that are supporting the efforts of the new church take heed. As far as almost destroying a thriving church.. I can tell you that we are all excited about Jason Gerdes coming to pastor us and we really think that his leadership is going to be able to grow and reach people that we never would have been able to before. Instead of looking at it as almost destroying Revolution.. I look at it as a hard pruning that will allow our tree to bear much fruit in the future. Thank you again for writing this great post.
Oh.. I want to followup as well too. I want to say a huge “Thank You” publically to Tim, Chad, Preston, Thad and the rest of the Revolution staff for continuing to lead us forward instead of dwelling on what had happened. Those guys have great courage and worked hard to do God’s work in Canton where many staff would have fallen apart. Thanks also to all the outside Pastors who preached, filled in and supported the Revolution staff during our churches transition.
Tony,
I think this was very well written and definitly out of love. Love for Gary and love for God’s people. There is a tremendous difference between forgiveness and restoration. I pray that Gary finds that restoration with the Lord before he does any more harm. It is fallen leadership like his that gives God’s people and His kingdom a black eye. There are so many unchurched people out there who will here about this situation and say to themselves; “What hypocrites!”. God’s Word says, ” You know the commandments, ‘Do not commit adultery, do not murder, do not steal, do not bear false witness, honor your father and mother.’” (NAS, Luke 18:18-20)
Tony, As a resident of Canton I have seen first hand the negative effects of Gary’s sin and the impact it has had on the local Church. Your words are well said and clearly come from a place of love and respect for God and the Church. Thanks for stepping out and sharing your thoughts.
Hey Tony, great post, you said what a true friend would. I believe that when someone is gets divorced and repent they can still be greatly active in churches and God can use them to make a huge difference for His glory, but I think the Bible makes it pretty clear that the door for being a pastor is closed. In 1 Timothy 3:2 Paul is giving a list of criteria that must be met to be a pastor and one of those is husband of one wife. I think the real issue is not that Gary is trying to start a church too soon, which he is, but that he is disobeying a clear mandate in the Bible seeking out a position which he has disqualified himself from.
Tony:
As a member of Revolution (and have been since almost the beginning) THANK YOU for standing for truth…Just as the message of the book of Nehemiah….Commitment to God requires more than words, it necessitates action (Celebrate Recovery Bible). The first step to ANY Recovery is to stop DENIAL…and I truly think that Gary is still in denial that he actually did anything wrong nor that he hurt his flock. I agree with David that the way the Staff at Revolution has stood together during this entire time, has not only made Revolution a stronger church family, but has also “tiled” the dirt to allow for more growth. Thank you again for being honest and sincere and stating what really needed to be said.
“faithful are the wounds of a friend.” I know this post took courage, but I appreciate your honesty. As pastors, we have a responsibility to protect the Gospel and protect the church, and you’re doing those things with this post.
Those of us who worked beside Gary and with Gary are sad and humbled through this situation. Pastors who are recklessly encouraging the steps he is taking are not honoring God nor acting in Godly wisdom.
Faithful are the wounds of a friend…
Wow, we need more people who can gently and lovingly speak truth like you in the church at large.
Thank you for this. I also hope that other pastors who have similar knowledge of the situation will post similar blogs to get the word out. It stinks that it has to be done, but there are people who are going to be hurt by Gary, and it’s not good for the Church as a whole for this to be going on. I people involved will see this.
As a member of Revolution, I am so glad that this has been posted with love. I agree with everything that Tony has said. My prayers are with the many new christians that attend Revolution who may follow Gary to his new church, these people may not understand everything that is going on in this situation. I for one feel that Gary leaving may be one of the best things to ever happen to Revolution. We now have a new pastor that has a foucs reaching those far from God, and a focus on building a MUCH needed youth group. After all a church can have more than one focus, just like a tree can have many branches.
Thank you for expressing honesty in a simple, respectful way! You are correct, it is not our job to judege, but as a good friend you have truthfully stated what so many of us have been thinking!
Tony, you took the words right out of my mouth! Thank you for sharing your thoughts in a constructive and positive manner. Revolution church is an amazing place that has changed a lot of lives including my own. We are thrilled to have a new pastor and excited to see what God has in store for us. Revolution is truly God’s church! I hope that Gary reads your blog and contemplates his future decisions thoroughly.
Well, many years ago, I was taught something that has stuck with me ever since. I was taught that ” A real friend is one that will not only say what you want to hear, or not want to hear, they will also tell you what you need to hear.”…Tony, I believe two things are very true here. One, you are sending Gary a message from God within you. Secondly, because of the first, I don’t believe that you are “judging” Gary in the context that others may think you are. You’re just simply stating what’s already in the Bible.
Tony,
The courage, humility and grace with which this post was written are breathtaking.
Thank you for loving the church enough to speak out for her. Thank you for loving Gary too. Thank you for having the courage to speak truth to the obnoxious absence of public opposition by those who should be and are qualified to speak to the issue.
If you were a stock I’d be ticked that I hadn’t invested in you earlier because your value just went through the roof!
I appreciate you man.
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I personally don’t know Gary, but read his blogs. After his last blog I too wondered what could he possibly be thinking. There’s no way he’s ready to lead a new church when he hasn’t been restored. One week his blog was hard & cold. Now he feels he’s ready to take on the world again. I pray for him, becauseI feel he’s going to hit rock bottom before he understands God is in control, not Gary or his so-called friends of encouragement. I feel he’s not only lying to himself, but concerned for those lives he may lead astray because of his ways.
Thanks for an excellent and superbly written column. Take Gary Lamb’s name out of it and it is still wise counsel to (sadly) many leaders in churches across the country. You’ve expressed the truth without compromising kindness. Difficult to do. Well done.
Tony,
I appreciate your thoughts & your heart. I respect your position & stand. I have followed Gary on Twitter but don’t know Gary. I continue to pray for his restoration & the healing he & his broken family needs. I do not advocate the anonymous attacks, or ongoing smear campaigning that has continued online. I do however respect the truth spoken in love, & you’ve done that. In all, I pray Gary becomes whole again & breaks free from his root sins. Thank you for speaking up, & doing so in a way that’s promotes truth & unity!!